Men Vs. Women and the Great Money Value Debate

Prefer to just listen? Catch our audio below!

This week on Feminine Wealth TV I interviewed Deborah Tutnauer, a life and adventure loving entrepreneur and Success Coach who helps people break through stuck and unleash greatness. We both have a keen interest in the great money / value debate, particularly with respect to how men deal with it versus women.

Deborah, aka ’The Question Master’, loves nothing more than to help frustrated entrepreneurs get real about money, marketing and meaning, so naturally I was super keen to get her on the show to talk about how women and men respond differently to the money topic …. and why!

We had a fascinating talk about the depths of the complexities we face when it comes to this thing called money and how, specifically, we have both noticed in our coaching of women the blocks that money can cause.

What I loved about interviewing Deborah was the chance to flesh out a topic that has been flowing around in my head for quite some time now. How women interact with money and how it differs to how men interact with money (speaking very generally of course) is a topic that we both feel is deep rooted in history going back to the dawn of time.

Some of the key things we dissected were

• Why women sometimes feel that charging a lot of money for their services might make people see them in a less than positive light.

• Why women find themselves apologising and underpricing their services in the business & working worlds.

• How change has to start from within women first before the change we want will be reflected back to us from outside.

Prefer to read? See full transcription below!

Barbara Turley: Hi, there. I’m Barbara Turley and you’re watching another episode of Feminine Wealth TV, the show that uncovers the diamond tips on creating truly conscious wealth from change makers, world shakers and wealth creators. I’m joined on the show today by Deborah Tutnauer. She is a transformational success coach, but we’re here today to talk about a slightly different topic because Deborah is becoming somewhat of an authority on the subject of women and money. Of course, this is very close to my own heart. We’re going to explore this topic today and try to figure out together why as women we have this kind of love-hate relationship with money. Deborah, welcome to the show. Thank you so much for joining me on this amazing topic.

Deborah Tutnauer: I am so excited to be here, Barbara. Across the timezones and the oceans, it’s so wonderful to finally connect.

Barbara Turley: Absolutely. You’re coming all the way from near Denver? Is it in Denver you are?

Deborah Tutnauer: No, actually I am in Colorado. I am about four and a half hours southwest of Denver and a mile higher.

Barbara Turley: You’re a big skier. You’re like me. You’re a big ski fan.

Deborah Tutnauer: A big skier. I live at 9,000 feet above sea level and it’s spring in pretty much all the rest of the United States except for here. As you can see by my clothes, it is still cold.

Barbara Turley: Still cold?

Deborah Tutnauer: That’s what happens in this altitude until probably another two weeks from now when it start to warm up.

Barbara Turley: What a beautiful place to live. Look, I’m so excited to explore this topic and I know you and I have spoken about this topic a few times on Skype and we’ve been swapping IDs, et cetera. Talk to me first though, I mean you’ve been an entrepreneur for 20 years. You’ve been running your own business for 20 years. You’ve been coaching. Tell me about the sort of history of where you … Why did you start as an entrepreneur? What was the journey?

Deborah Tutnauer: I just love that question. I graduated from college in 1981 with a bachelor’s degree in psychology which at that time maybe even now it doesn’t get you anywhere unless you go to graduate school. 1981 was what I used to call or still call the dress for success era. Everyone I graduated with went on to become an investment banker or went to law school or went to med school or interviewed in some kind of corporate training program. None of those resonated for me. I really wasn’t sure. I’ve always lived my life even as a teenager, making choices based on what really had deep meaning for me. When I graduated from college, none of the things that everyone else was doing resonated for me. I ended up not applying for grad school. I took a year off and then I started on my journey.

The only thing I knew about my journey at that point in time was, and this is going to be funny for our topic today, money was not important to me. I couldn’t work in a corporation following somebody else’s rules. Those were the only things I knew for sure when I was 21 years old. That was the beginning of the journey.

Barbara Turley: I think a lot of 21 year olds particularly today when this topic of meaning and having a meaningful career is coming up for a lot of people. I think it would resonate again today or sort of back to the 80s at the moment.

Deborah Tutnauer: It was funny. I was very unusual. Everybody who were my friends at the time, they just didn’t get it. Like, “What do you mean you’re not going to get a traditional job? How are you going to live? How are you going to do this?” For a few years I figured it out. I did things that I loved. I skied and I taught aerobics just like Jane Fonda. I taught weight training. I competed in some body building competitions and I volunteered and started volunteering in classrooms. That really became the beginning of my professional journey. I went on to get a master’s degree in special education. I have worked with a very … What’s the word I want to use? Very involved population. That would be the best thing to use. Children who had many challenges, multiple challenges, physical, mental, emotional in a public school system.

That certainly wasn’t entrepreneurial, but I did entrepreneurial things within that context. I stepped out of the role that they’d hired me to do and I went in and worked with parents in their homes with their kids. I really brought in a program. Realized in that journey same thing that I was beholden to other people’s structures and rules. Really felt that my level of creativity and pushing up the boundaries wasn’t supported within the structure of the school district. I went back to school. I received another master’s degree in clinical social work. That was really the beginning then of my true entrepreneurial journey that is earning money by setting off my own business. I didn’t consider myself an entrepreneur at the time. I called myself just like the IRS forms in the United States call you.

I was a solo practitioner. I was a solo proprietor and didn’t even think of the word entrepreneur until much later down the road many, many years into my private practice as a clinician when I began to explore other ways of earning income besides just sitting in an office doing 50 minute, hours with the kids and families.

Barbara Turley: That’s very interesting because where did it come to the point? You said that money wasn’t something that was important to you in the beginning. Then you sort of came to this point where you realized, “Okay. I’m earning an income sitting in this chair, but how do I earn more passive type income?” Where did the shift happen there? This shift into …

Deborah Tutnauer: Good question. I always felt up until I would say maybe the last eight or nine years, I kind of believed in the “money was the root of all evil” thing. I didn’t believe in greed. I didn’t believe in just doing things to earn money. I was really turned off by what went on in, again my center is the United States, so what went on on Wall Street and what I saw again people who I grew up with. I felt they were selling their souls for an income and they didn’t have a life. I was so turned off by that. When I met my husband about 16, 17 years ago, I said to him, “I don’t need anything. I just need a TP and I need a car and I need to be able to afford my car and I need to be able to pay for gas and pay for food. Then go on really cool adventures, but I don’t need any material goods.”

That was how I approached life. I still feel the same way about material goods. I think there was a definite shift in the value of money when I became a mother. It’s really expensive to raise a child.

Barbara Turley: I think about women. That’s when we hit that point of going, “Oh, maybe money is a little bit more important than I’ve been giving it credit for.”

Deborah Tutnauer: It wasn’t that money wasn’t important. Money was important, but only enough. Money was important because money was the vehicle and still is the vehicle to the other things in life that are really important. For me, time freedom is very important. Independence is very important. Making an impact on other’s lives is a very strong value of mine and having adventures, having experiences and being really engaged with my family, my friends, my community, those are the things that are of highest importance to me. Money was always nothing more than the vehicle to those things. As many have come to realize as life gets more complicated, all those things become more complicated and thus more expensive.

Hopping in a car by oneself to travel around the country or figuring out how to be a courier to go to Europe is one thing when you’re single and fancy free, but when you’ve got family, it becomes a whole different experience and you need money to do those things. I had to come to a place where money ceased to be evil and in fact money became important in the sense of its value in making other things happen.

Barbara Turley: I’m interested for a second. Let’s focus on this “money is the root of all evil” because that is such an ingrained belief. I wonder whether and I know we’ve had this conversation in the past before, particularly for women, even though we may not verbalize it that way of money being the root of all evil, I think a lot of us actually have that almost in our DNA. We inherently feel that money … Because money has been used, it’s quite a masculine concept as we know. It has been born of a very masculine way of doing things because obviously men have been the ones out since the dawn of time hunting, gathering, creating and women have been the ones in the home. Also money has been used as a tool that is kind of a controlled tool. It’s been used as a power.

Often it’s been used against women in a lot of ways. I’m wondering whether as women do we feel that somehow money is in direct conflict with our own feminine values? Is that something that you’re seeing or feeling a little bit in the work that you’re doing?

Deborah Tutnauer: I think that’s a huge topic.

Barbara Turley: Yeah, I know.

Deborah Tutnauer: I’m trying to think of where I want to address it because you asked multiple questions in that question.

Barbara Turley: Yeah.

Deborah Tutnauer: I think as you and I have spoken about, money has been used … Money is power. We know that and we know it in reverse too. If women want the kind of power from a social impact standpoint to change the world, then women are going to have to step up and raise money because it’s hard to be heard if you don’t have that power. Whether we agree with it or not, we live in a culture, a cross Western society, that money kind of fuels that power. In reverse, I agree with you. I think money has been used to subjugate forever maybe for women. I mean women weren’t allowed to touch money. Women didn’t have control of money. Men made the decisions. Men even chose what women use money on whether it was for shopping or what they bought for the house. I think there is as you said that undercurrent in our DNA. I also think when … I don’t want to say men don’t do this also when push comes to shove.

Barbara Turley: Because that’s a generalization.

Deborah Tutnauer: I don’t want to say men don’t do this, but when I speak with women clients and when I speak with women friends about the world and about the problems in the world whether it’s hunger and war and famine and violence and violence against women, all the things that we know are going on, destruction of the environment, all the things that are going on in our world I think we tend to see men as the purveyors of those things. Men are making the decisions in the countries. Men are going to war. Men are doing all these things that are requiring money to do and would require money to not do. I think even when we aren’t really dissecting it deeply, there’s an undercurrent within us of these negative things are tied to money and we don’t have that power and so money must be bad.

Barbara Turley: Absolutely.

Deborah Tutnauer: It’s just sort of this, “If this, then this then this then this,” even though all those ifs, thens might not be true, it is how our brain is perceiving what’s going on that’s super negative. Women don’t have a lot of impact. Certain women do. We could all name them. We probably all name many of the same ones, but women as a powerful force for change in the world at large don’t have it yet in the way that men do. When you don’t have it and it looks like it’s doing negative things, you then put a negative connotation on it.

Barbara Turley: I love that you’ve dissected that so well I have to say because I know that was a complex question. I know we’ve had this discussion a few times. I’m really interested because I know as well as women that we have a lot of women at the moment launching businesses. Probably for two decades we’ve had women … Twice the number of women launching businesses as we do men. We’ve had more women than men coming out graduating university for probably 20 or 30 years now and yet, we still have women earning less money than men. We still have less women running multimillion dollar businesses than men. Again it’s not that it’s all about the money, but there is some sort of blockage I think around this women and money topic.

I’m interested to hear your take on when you’re coaching women in business in particular, what are you seeing around how they approach business or how they approach starting a business compared to how men would approach it?

Deborah Tutnauer: When I coach, I’m a little … I’m a fucking business coach. I am not your MBA school spreadsheet business plan business coach. I’m the person that people come to not for the hard, by hard I don’t mean difficult, I mean like the hard like factual concrete parts of business. I’m more of the person that people come to when they got this feeling that they want to launch a business or they’ve already launched a business, but they don’t have a firm grasp on what’s it’s really about, who their audience really is, what their impact really is, what they’re trying to achieve or they can’t seem to get their … Wrap their mind around their values and their passions and how you translate those into a business that is going to earn more money or they’re working a business and they’re really unhappy and they can’t figure out why that is.

All of that I call inner gain. That’s why people come to me generally is there’s an inner gain challenge that they’re having and they can’t quite grasp it but either they’re not happy, they’re unsure, they’re confused and tied into all that generally is they’re either not making money or they are making money but they’re so not clear and unhappy on what they’re doing that they don’t even want that money anymore. When I’m working with people, I’m doing two things simultaneously. I’m helping people discover their own set of really deep core values, the thing that they’re really never going to compromise on and helping people dig deeply into what they’re really good at. I think too really good at are often things that you don’t think you can charge for because you’re so good at them and they come so easy for you that you assume everyone else can do that.

Barbara Turley: Surely everybody must know that.

Deborah Tutnauer: Surely everybody must know that. Then we decide on what their passions, their purpose, their meaning, their expertise, how to put that all together to create a business and then what is that business, what are you selling, what is your product, what is your service, who is your audience, how are you going to charge for this. We start with the soft stuff and with a very concrete marketing plan, with a sales funnel, with all the things that businesses ultimately have to get to which are the hard things, right? The concrete things. What are you selling? How are you going to price it? How are you going to get the money to come in? Who is your audience? How are you going to market? We end there.

What’s so interesting going back to your original question is I do both those pieces. When I have a man on the phone and again this is not 100% male or women, but in general, they want to know from the beginning how they’re going to make money. I have a really hard time initially getting them to focus on what are your values.

Barbara Turley: What lights you up.

Deborah Tutnauer: What’s really important to you? What’s your purpose in life when you’re on your deathbed? What’s going to have had meaning to you? They just want to know, “Okay. I got this idea. I’m going to like sell this piece of equipment. I’m going to sell it from this warehouse. I just want you to help me make a website and market this thing.” When I start to talk about, “Well, what is your unique value proposition for instance and tying that back into what makes them different from someone else selling the same piece of equipment in the warehouse,” it’s a hard thing to get them to not want to just talk about, “This the price and this the money and how am I going to sell it.” Whereas women want to talk about their feelings and their values and their passion and their purpose.

I’m thinking right now of a client I’m just finishing up with who is on this incredible journey to work with people who are going through separation and divorce. She has a beautiful structure of course list and books and all kinds of things. It’s been harder even though she has a good business mind to get her to focus on the funnel.

Barbara Turley: The money. Where is the extra revenue coming from?

Deborah Tutnauer: This is awesome. Where’s the money coming from? Oh, yeah. Sometimes it takes me hitting that question from a number of different directions to get my female clients to say, “Okay. Yes. I planned this piece. I get the concept. I get the values. I get the passion, the purpose, the audience, the avatar. I even get it onto the market. I get the wording, but now I have to focus on the funnel. I have to focus on how to price these things and where am I going to find my customers or my clients and how it’s all going to blow and ultimately how it’s going to become a business not just this really cool passionate idea.”

Barbara Turley: When you hit that point with a female client, do you find any resistance coming up there of not wanting to approach that part of the … Like a tiredness, exhaustion coming into that part of the conversation or why is that?

Deborah Tutnauer: I don’t find tiredness, exhaustion. What I do find is … Not everyone. We’re talking in general here.

Barbara Turley: In general. Yeah.

Deborah Tutnauer: What I do find is, “Oh, that will be … Okay.” Because I work with a lot of solopreneurs, so people with very small businesses. They’ll say, “Well, I think I should price my services X,” and I’ll say, “Really?” They’ll say, “Well, I mean you get that sort of soft, mushy … Well, what about the people who can’t afford me and I don’t want people to think I’m greedy.” You get that all of a sudden that whole constellation comes up which comes back to what you and I have spoken about. I think we also spoken about earlier today is that feeling of not really wanting to make a stand and saying, “Yes, this product, this service has this value. Yes, this is what it really is going to cost,” and yes, that’s really okay. It’s more of a like, “Once I put a value on it, aren’t I becoming one of those greedy people? Aren’t I becoming something uncomfortable?”

Barbara Turley: This gets to this point of money is associated with greed. It has a very strong link still and Wall Street hasn’t helped. Let’s be honest. I mean The Wolf of Wall Street even the movie I’m thinking no wonder people have such an aversion to the whole concept of money, wealth, creating more. I’m wondering and again this is such a huge question in one line, but in your experience, you’re a coach, you went to this transformational stuff, why do you feel as women we have this aversion to the money discussion? Again gross generalization, but I’m seeing with clients I talked to, I see it a lot. It is something that we as women like … Often women will say to me … You wouldn’t believe I do get this, but I get women saying to me, “Oh, but I’m not in it for the money.

I think well, nobody’s in it for the money, but that’s sort of implying that the money’s not important as part of business and unfortunately it is an extremely important part of business right up there with passion and money. They’re kind of the two fuels that drive big businesses and change and amazing revolutions I guess. Why is it as women, generalization I know, do we feel this way when it comes to the money discussion? Huge question.

Deborah Tutnauer: Okay. There’s a lot of answers to that question. There’s what we’ve already talked about the connotation that money and greed and The Wolf of Wall Street and abuses of the power. There’s all those pieces, right?

Barbara Turley: Yup. Yup.

Deborah Tutnauer: That’s an undercurrent. I think on an individual level and you know somebody’s going to comment on this and just blast me for saying this, but I think I find, I have seen in all my work with women over 20 years both as a therapist and now working as an entrepreneur business coach, women have a really hard time valuing themselves at the level that they really are valuable.

Barbara Turley: I agree 100%.

Deborah Tutnauer: I’ve taken a stand and kind of like I am woman, hear me roar and yes. Like yes, I am worth this. My expertise is worth this. This product I developed is worth this. I think it’s really hard for women to balance within themselves the reality of their own value to themselves and to society and also that feeling of if I value myself, if I charge this amount of money, their concern that people will see them in a light that is not positive. Men put on their suit and their tie and they go into let’s say their job interview and they’re asked, “What you want for a salary,” and they will consistently pick a number that is actually higher than is normal for that particular job.”

Barbara Turley: Of course.

Deborah Tutnauer: Studies have shown that women will do the same thing. They’ll dress up. They’ll go in and they’ll have their interview. They’ll feel really strong and when the person on the other side of the desk says, “What salary would you like,” they will pick a number that’s actually lower than the salary that’s normal for that particular job. It’s almost like, “So you think it would be sort of kind of okay if I like sort of kind of almost ask for this amount of money?” That’s the feeling that comes through and I think it’s a mixture of being able to embrace, like really embrace all of their value. I think it’s also the fear of being viewed as instead of a strong powerful woman, being too brazen.

Barbara Turley: Yeah. Ego. There’s too much ego attached to overinflated.

Deborah Tutnauer: Men who have ego are perceived as powerful. Women who have ego are perceived as that other B word.

Barbara Turley: Yeah. Yeah. It’s not attractive. It’s not feminine and it’s not … Who wants to be that woman?

Deborah Tutnauer: People will say to me, “Well, where does the change start?” I think it has to start in all places.

Barbara Turley: I agree.

Deborah Tutnauer: I think it has to start within women. Almost the 1970s Gloria Steinem consciousness raising. I think it has to start with as women and mothers and a generation who can inform a younger generation raising those girls and those young women to not have those same connotations. At the same time it needs to start when you’re in that salary room. Not being afraid to state that value so that the person on the other side has to really deal with their feelings about it. Standing up for women as a whole, getting paid what they’re worth. I mean all the different pieces just like any kind of cultural change, it has to start from the inside out and it also has to come from the outside in.

Barbara Turley: I’m so glad you said that because one thing I’m really passionate about talking about and I actually was talking on this topic at a recent event here in Sydney where I feel that this is … Sometimes as women as well and a generalization we can say, “Well, men don’t give us airtime in corporate worlds or in interviews or in salary negotiations,” when actually I believe this is more of a society wide issue where as women … You’re right. It needs to start within us. Being aware of some of our own subconscious beliefs and biases around money and how we’re reflecting that back on the world is actually causing … It’s perpetuating this cycle. I feel as women we need to step up into our power, into our feminine power and then actually the world will start to reflect back what we really want.

I love that this is a … Yeah, I think it’s more of a society issue and society will benefit massively. If women want to create the change that we want to create, it starts with ourselves and how we talk to our daughters.

Deborah Tutnauer: We don’t have to be men to be valued.

Barbara Turley: No. Not at all.

Deborah Tutnauer: You said it right there. The feminine power is so important. It’s not dressing and becoming little men.

Barbara Turley: Absolutely not. Be feminine.

Deborah Tutnauer: It’s not that at all.

Barbara Turley: There’s a reason I call this show Feminine Wealth TV because the next topic I want to get onto is this concept that we’ve been talking about of a kind of a revolution around the way … How we interact with money and how the whole of society interacts with wealth. I feel that as women if we do step up into this feminine power, we have the power to change how wealth is distributed in our world, how money is used and then we change the connotations that we attach to money. Actually as women, we have a power. We actually have a great opportunity right now to cause a very positive revolution around money and wealth and how we all interact with it in society. What’s your view on that?

Deborah Tutnauer: I just love that. All I want to do is like clap. Right?

Barbara Turley: It’s powerful. I know. I even get goosebumps when I say it.

Deborah Tutnauer: You said something to me when we spoke a few months ago before I was going to a university to give a talk to women about money, young women who were still in college. One of the things that you said which I just … It just stuck with me and I’ve been using it.

Barbara Turley: Oh, good.

Deborah Tutnauer: I’ve been crediting you to many women over and over again is the idea of all the things that you just said which is so crucial. It’s not just me in my family, in my kitchen, in my office, in my living room, in my community. It’s me as a women stepping into my power and changing almost that vibration by my connection with other women and other women and other women and other women. That is how change happens throughout the entire world. Everything you just said I love so much. The thing that stuck with me that you also said is if women don’t want the money for themselves, there’s a lot of places that need that money. There’s a lot of things. If you want to live a monastic life in your TP which I used to want to do and still have dreams about, you don’t have to be greedy.

You don’t have to buy Lamborghini’s and diamonds and yachts and live a drug fueled orgy type Wolf on Wall Street existence just because you earn a lot of money. You could earn that money and if you don’t want it, give it away. We can all list 20 places that could use your millions today and make a huge difference in the world. You know what? Back to one of your earlier questions, that was the cross of the switch for me when I realized that money was nothing more or less than a vehicle to all the things that I wanted for my life and my family and of all the impact I wanted to make on the world and other people’s lives and other people’s families. Money was the vehicle to that because that’s how our world works. That’s how it works.

I can send my $100 to $500 today to some organization in Nepal and that’s awesome. Imagine if I could take a million dollars and charter a plane and show up in Nepal in some village that nobody is impacting and those people still are living in tents, how much more wonderful would that be?

Barbara Turley: For you as well. Could you imagine? You can be fulfilled in lots of ways. Something you said on another interview that I watched that you did was that some people … When you’re struggling financially, you don’t have time, energy, space, anything to even create the energetic space to think about anybody else or impacting the world or anything because you’re just trying to get through the day-to-day. A lot of people are living that way. I say to some women … They say, “It’s not about money for me,” and I go, “Well, you’ve been lucky enough to be born into one of the top, I don’t know, like 1% of places in the world. You’ve had the privilege of the highest educational standards in the world. Who are you not to make money and to use that money to actually elevated others if that’s what you choose to do?”

If you want to buy Lamborghini’s and diamonds and all that, that’s fine too. There’s an awful lot of people saying, “I don’t want the money,” and I go, “Yeah, but if you have an ability to make it, then maybe you have a responsibility to go and make it and then let’s channel it in the right way and bring our feminine energy to the money industry.” Then maybe money won’t have such negative connotations. It’s up to us to infuse it with the values that we really want to see it portray. That’s kind of my view on this whole topic.

Deborah Tutnauer: I love that so much because when you work with … You and I I would assume … I don’t know your background, but just where you are now. I would guess that you weren’t raised in a slum.

Barbara Turley: No.

Deborah Tutnauer: You weren’t raise in a third world country. You weren’t walking too much for your water.

Barbara Turley: No. No.

Deborah Tutnauer: I think I agree with you and I’ve said this a lot of my life, there is a level of privilege to growing in a Western country, growing up in the middle class or upper middle class family, growing up where you didn’t walk for food and shelter and heat and you have the privilege of being able to say, “Oh, money’s not important or I don’t know want to that. I want to live in my TP. I don’t want to get a job,” or whatever. That is so not the norm for the majority of people on this earth.

Barbara Turley: Yeah. I mean girls … I always say this, I mean we still have girls or children being sold into sex slavery and we have all these different … There’s a woman I’m very close to who lives in Bali. I’ve had her on the show actually and she runs the Bali Children Foundation. I talked to her about this topic of girls in sex slavery and all of this stuff. I asked her her view about the money issue in relation to this and she said, “Oh, yeah. That’s very much about money because that girl … Her family will actually support that because that girl can earn 10 times more money doing that for the family than she ever could.” Actually it’s almost like an honor to send her into that. That was the psyche of what I didn’t realize that that’s the psyche of a family like that. Yes, that means that money … It’s very much a money decision.

It’s driven by this powerful tool called money. I just think we can channel things in a different way to change that in so many different ways. As women, that’s my calling to all women to listen to these conversations and to start to yeah, step into that fear or whatever that feeling is about asking for more money, you just own that because that is your right and that is your value.

Deborah Tutnauer: I love what you said a little while ago. Who are you to not make the money? You have the ability to make the money. It’s almost like your responsibility. You were lucky enough to be in this position. It’s your responsibility to make that money so that you can help those people who are not in those situations who need your help. It’s so huge in that way. For people also to step outside of their own …

Barbara Turley: Themselves.

Deborah Tutnauer: Themselves and to step outside of their own like … See that it’s about more than just you. Then the other piece is to go back inside. If you are having an issue with money, if you do have fears around money, if you can’t own your own value, then dig into that. Get some help. Get a therapist. Get a coach. Talk to a friend. Call up Barbara.

Barbara Turley: Or Deborah.

Deborah Tutnauer: Instead of just sort of pushing it aside and glancing over it, get into it. Figure out where it is for you and what it is for you and what messages you’ve been carrying around. I work with stories a lot. What’s the story that you’ve been carrying around for decades that might not be true? It’s not letting you take that next step. That’s not letting you step into your power. Get some help. Dig into that story and shift it. You can always shift it. Every single day you wake up, you can decide that you’re going to do it different. If something’s blocking you, get some help or do some of your own inner work and get rid of that block so you can be bold.

Barbara Turley: Deborah, if our viewers want to connect with you and follow this conversation of it more on your blog and they’re following it already on mine, where should they go to connect with you?

Deborah Tutnauer: Super simple. Just onto my website which is my name Would you like me to spell it?

Barbara Turley: No, it should be on the screen right now.

Deborah Tutnauer: Okay. is my website, my blog. I write blog posts about … This will show up on a blog post. This will show up on a podcast. Join in the conversation. There’s a contact link if you want to contact me directly. I love comments and I’ll respond to your comments. I’m really easy to find there. If you Google me, I’m really easy to find. Google finds me all the time.

Barbara Turley: Yeah, you are. I Googled you earlier. Listen Deborah, that’s been fabulous. It’s such an amazingly powerful topic and I know we’ve had a few discussions about it. Thank you so much for coming on the show today and helping me to explore this topic even further.

Deborah Tutnauer: You are so welcome. It’s an honor. It’s really an honor. I love your website, Barbara. I love what you’re doing. I’m so glad we connected and I hope this is the beginning of more conversations and there are some things maybe we could do together to help women go boldly for it.

Barbara Turley: I think so. Yeah. Thank you again for joining me for another week for Feminine Wealth TV. Remember you can catch me later this week on my podcast Wealth Unplugged on iTunes or over on my website I’ll be giving you my three key takeouts with my chat today with Deborah. Until next week, have a great week. We’ll see you then.

Haven’t got time to watch the full show?

Then hop on over to the Wealth Unplugged Podcast where I share my quick take on these 3 key points.

How do you feel about the money / value topic? Do men and women deal with it differently?

Let us know in the comments below …

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